VIDEO: Birds of Prey “Three Birds and a Baby”

Solkir’s look at the WB’s Birds of Prey continues with the very special baby episode!

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TV Show: Birds of Prey

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  • CaptainCalvinCat

    Interesting way of counting – gotta admit that. 1,2,c. I’m impressed. ^^

  • Animikean

    The double image and overdubbing, you’re getting really good at this.
    It was sharp and punchy, can’t wait for the next one 🙂

    • CaptainCalvinCat

      Except for the reasons this double-image was not very punchy.
      See – we know, that Huntress’s enemies die. We know, that that “We don’t kill” combined with Huntresses killing comes of as hypocritic, although I think that the moments, in which Huntress killed were self-defense or she couldn’t have done something different. See the discussion in “Prey for the Hunter” – that guy stood on the roof, he WANTED to jump, what could she have done?
      The water guy? Well – he was pretty much killing another detective so – yeah, what would have been another course of action? Okay, she could have used the flame-extinguisher-trick, that she used on herself, however… was there one? No – could she have gotten one in time? Not likely. So – she uses, what she has. That is … unfortunate for the water-guy, but… *shrugs*
      And the guy, that tried to kill her in her mind was… well… trying to kill her in her mind.
      So I call it “killing in self-defence”…

      But – okay: For arguments sake, say, that the message, she wants to give to guy is: “You don’t kill anyone – like at all – because that makes you as bad as the bad guys.” while she herself is killing people.
      Soooo?
      What’s your point? Should she have said “Of course it is not right to kill but – erm… I do that every time?”
      Wayyy to talk to a person, who was just a baby couple of hours ago. And even if we would be talking “normal teenager” here – you don’t tell your teenage son, that yes, drinking alcohol in masses is bad, but you guzzle half a gallon of whiskey every day.
      You say “Drinking is bad” – period.
      It’s called “Rising a child.”

      As a parent, sometimes you can’t help, but lie. that comes with the job.
      It is your job to say “Everything is gonna be okay.”
      And that is just in real-life-environments. In reality, you, as a parent, have the damn duty to calm down your kid, who just heard on the news, that russia is moving in and heard from other persons that WW3 might be happening soon. It is your duty as a parent to make the kid believe, that this is situation is probably clearing up soon, nothing is going to happen and that everything is going to be normal, soon.
      It is your job, as a parent, to calm the kid down, when the kid listened to a talk between you and your wife/husband, in which it was laid down, that your financial situations is going to be very grim, very soon. It is your job then to smile a the child and say “Nahh, everything is going to be fine.”
      Why? Because that’s your kid, your his parents.

      Okay, coming back to birds of prey here:
      What should Huntress have said?
      “Yeah, I kill people everytime. the talk about “Not killing anyone” is utter bullshit – come on, let’s kick some ass?”
      of course not, because THAT would have been horrible.
      But Huntress telling that kid, that it is wrong to kill (while she has done it in the past)…. yeah… not so much.

      • jjramsey

        What’s your point? Should she have said “Of course it is not right to kill but – erm… I do that every time?”

        The problem is that the writers have the characters pay lip service to a “no killing” rule that they obviously don’t follow. That would be okay if the characters were deliberately being depicted as hypocritical or inconsistent, but it looks more like the writers are not being consistent.

        As for what Huntress could tell Guy, how about “Don’t kill except in self-defense or in the immediate defense of others, and try to avoid killing unless you don’t have much of a choice”? That’s pretty much the rule she effectively goes by, anyway.

        • CaptainCalvinCat

          @jiramsey “Don’t kill except in self-defense or in the immediate defense of
          others, and try to avoid killing unless you don’t have much of a choice” – you just described the “No Killing”-rule as I saw it through the enitre show.
          And that was, what Huntress did. She killed in self defence.

          @animikean
          “You could have “Guy” age stabilize, run away realize what Huntress said
          versus did and by feeling betrayed by that join with Quinzel against
          them.”

          Okay… erm…. Why?
          Why would guy feel betrayed? Because “Oh, you are allowed to kill, and I am not?”
          Naaah – too much unnecessary drama.

          • jjramsey

            you just described the “No Killing”-rule as I saw it through the enitre show. And that was, what Huntress did. She killed in self defence.

            And that would be fine if Huntress wasn’t also paying lip service to a far more absolutist version of the “No Killing” rule. The problem is that it doesn’t make sense for her to tell someone else that killing makes one just like the bad guys when she clearly doesn’t act as if she believes that.

            Contrast this with, say, Vash the Stampede from Trigun, who does his best to go by the strict version of the “No Killing” rule that the characters of Birds of Prey claim to believe in. The writers of Trigun followed through with the complications that came from such a rule, which produced quite a bit of the dramatic tension in the series, both in Vash’s conflicts with both allies and enemies, and in Vash’s own internal conflicts.

          • CaptainCalvinCat

            @jiramsey
            “And that would be fine if Huntress wasn’t also paying lip service to a
            far more absolutist version of the “No Killing” rule. The problem is
            that it doesn’t make sense for her to tell someone else that killing
            makes one just like the bad guys when she clearly doesn’t act as if she
            believes that.”

            Well, I seem to be an interpretive viewer. I see, hear and then interpret.

            I see, they say “We don’t kill” and yet people die, because the birds defended themselves against those people or because those people are idiots, who did not want to live anymore, so they cannonballed into the concrete below them.
            What does that mean?
            Well OBVIOUSLY it means something like “We don’t kill, until it is absolutely necessary – or people just jump from rooftops.”

            Never watched Trigun, so – yaaay for bringing something up?

          • TheCrazyFish

            That’s all well and good but the way I see it, if you say you believe in something and then you don’t follow through, then you don’t believe in that thing. Period.

            It’s like… if I said “I never drink alcohol” and then I go out and down a six pack of beer, I can’t say “oh well, you just misinterpreted, what I really meant was I don’t drink whiskey.” No. If I say that I don’t drink alcohol and then I go ahead and drink alcohol then that makes me a liar.

            This is exactly the same. If she meant “I don’t kill except when I have to” then she should have SAID that, but she didn’t. She said, “I don’t kill.” Period. No qualifiers, no exceptions, no special cases. She said that she doesn’t kill, and then she kills. That makes her a liar. Period.

          • CaptainCalvinCat

            Crazy, you were actually listening to the words, coming out of Helenas mouth, yes?
            She is not saying “I don’t kill”.
            She said: “I am facing that choice every single day, we can’t do that.”
            Plus – what you are so kindly forgetting is, that she is talking to a frakking KID!
            You don’t say to your kid: “Oh yes, I drink whiskey all the time!” because you don’t want your kid to drink whiskey, you want your kid to live a far more healthier life.

            Okay, why not saying to the kid: “Yeah, you’re right. I kill every day. I kill on monday, I kill on tuesday, I kill on wednesday and on thursday, I kill people, who are already dead. ”
            Let’s switch on our brains here, shall we?
            Why doesn’t she say that?
            Again: She is talking to a KID.
            A person, she feels responsible for.

            Do I really need to explain to you, why it would be wrong, to tell that kid, that is already “born to kill”, that it is wrong to do that, even if you yourself do it?
            Do I?
            REALLY?

          • TheCrazyFish

            Oh, come the Hell off it. No one’s saying that she should say “I kill all the time ‘cuz it’s fun! WHEE DEATH!” Obviously, that would be stupid. What we’re saying is that she shouldn’t be a liar and a hypocrite.

            Here’s why: kids are WAY smarter than people like to give them credit for. It’s actually very easy for children to realize when adults are lying, and unlike what you and every terrible parent out there in the world thinks they NEVER decide that you’re telling them things for their own sake. That’s why kids start smoking and drinking despite being told not to – their parents tell them how horrible drinking is, but then go ahead and do it themselves. The kid is smart enough to realize the parent is a hypocrite, but not quite smart enough to realize the parent is trying to lead them down a better path than the one they took.

            If she tells him “I don’t kill” and then he witnesses her killing, he’s not going to think “Oh, she told me that for my own sake, to lead me down a better path.” NO. He’s going to think “She’s a liar and a hypocrite. If she does it then it must be okay, no matter what she says to the contrary, so I’ll do it too. Yay, death!”

            If she had simply said, instead, “we only kill when it’s necessary” or “we only kill in self-defense” or even “we only kill when people really deserve it” then she could avoid the whole thing.

            Do I really have to explain why being a liar and a hypocrite and ruining other peoples’ lives with your own irresponsibility is wrong? Do I? REALLY?

          • CaptainCalvinCat

            So, here’s what I got of your writing:
            Kids are smart enough to realize that they are being lied to, but stupid enough to not realize the background of it.

          • TheCrazyFish

            YEEEEEEEESSSSS.

      • Animikean

        We are in completely different head-spaces
        I laughed, hard at the sequence

        If BoP was a better show you’d have a point.
        You could have “Guy” age stabilize, run away realize what Huntress said versus did and by feeling betrayed by that join with Quinzel against them.
        But no, this is a one off one shot episode meant to elicit cheap feels and the “lessons” of it won’t be felt even in the next episode.

    • Solkir

      Thanks. I was trying to play it in the corner over the scene, but found that it was actually way easier to do it this way.